No Doom3 Editor on Linux

January 31st, 2003 by jvm

Dan Naumov, having heard that the MacOS version of Doom3 would not include the editor (perhaps from a 2002 E3 report), sent word that he had emailed John Carmack directly about whether the Linux version would have the editor. Here is the full reply he forwarded to us:

Unfortunately, it [the editor] is probably going to be a win32-only feature. We might support the possibility of building a separate, standalone linux versionbased off of the Radiant work, but it would lack the integration features,and we aren’t committed to it. I would be happiest with complete supporton all platforms, but the editor code has a bunch of win32 assumptions init, and supporting a cross platform version would be more work than I canjustify.

This can be considered an official response.

John Carmack

I think that speaks for itself. It’s tempting to fly off the handle and damn those evil Windows programmers. Yet, given the realities of the Linux gaming market, it is a completely reasonable business decision. That we’re getting the client in addition to the server is probably already more than our numbers deserve.

25 Responses to “No Doom3 Editor on Linux”

  1. Anonymous Says:

    I’m planning on buying a Pentium4 3.x GHz, supporting motherboard and peripherals, and hopefully a R350 class video card around the time that Doom 3 comes out.

    Its not going to be running linux for gaming.

  2. Anonymous Says:

    someday we will get editors ported too. In the meantime, we can enjoy what we get.

    To ask for more is human; to demand more and cry about it is childish.

  3. Anonymous Says:

    While I might try to be disappointed in this, I have trouble with being disappointed. I’ll buy Doom 3, and I’ll probably have some fun with it too. But I can’t imagine myself using the editor.

  4. Anonymous Says:

    “Baaaaaah…” — bleating-sheep troll alert!

  5. Dweebs Says:

    Carmack is God.

    He has supported Linux gaming more than anyone else.
    Besides, I’d never use the editor and I do have a rather dusty Win9x partician for just such a problem. I’m just happy we are getting a client.


  6. dnaumov Says:

    The problem with Doom 3 is that it will have little to no multiplayer, dramatically lowering it’s replay value and having no level editor will lower my interest in the game even further. f the game in question was QuakeWorld or UT, I wouldn’t have such a big problem with it, because those games have HUGE replayability value due to their multiplayer aspect, but what am I gonna do with Doom 3 ? Play it through once ? Ok, twice ? Now what ? Put it on a shelf to collect dust ? No thanks…

    What REALLY annoys me is the fact that Doom 3 is going to have “crippled” multi-platform support. The editor is gonna be avaible in Windows, but not Linux and Mac. The same thing is happening to NWN as well as it’s toolset is only avaible for Windows. The lack of editor for Linux has effectively killed my interest in UT2003 as well, mainly because I think the game itself is vastly inferior to QuakeWorld. If UT2003 editor was avaible for Linux, I would probably be creating some content because of it’s engine capabilities and that would make me have at least some interest in the game…

  7. Anonymous Says:

    Gee. I am a die-hard quake fanatic. I loved quake. I loved quake2. Quake was DEFINITELY a single player game (as was doom, doom2), but they had pretty damned good multiplayer aspects as well. I know carmack definitely has some multiplayer bits in doom3, and think people are missing the boat when he says, this is a single player oriented game. That just meands its an FPS thats worth playing by yourself. In all of what, 8, 9 years of quaking, cant say ive ever used the editor but once. And that was the weird quake2 level editor that wasnt really part of quake2. Some people might be displeased we arent getting an editor. But you know what? Carmack never said “four legs to a table!” (glare at bioware). He never said “this single player game was made with the intent you make your own worlds to share with others, limited only by your creativity!” No no, he said “this the damned finest FPS engine you will see for years to come. Grok the magnificience that is Doom3 single player”. I, in no way, feel let down by this statement, compared to the hype associated with a certain other editor we have come to loathe not having.

  8. Anonymous Says:

    I doubt Carmack is writing much of the editor. And yes, people that learned to program on windows usually can’t make any cross-platform to save their life.

  9. Anonymous Says:

    [q][i]”That we’re getting the client in addition to the server is probably already more than our numbers deserve.”[/q][/i]

    Stop saying things like this. Every gaming platform had to start somewhere.

  10. Anonymous Says:

    No offense to Carmack, but all I have to say is “Fuck Win32!”.
    I don’t get it, they’ve got a nice track of supporting Linux and MacOS, so they should be able to have coded the editor cross-platform friendly from the start.

  11. Anonymous Says:

    what is this nasty trend..first bioware with neverwinter nights breaks initial promise and we dont get a toolset now carmack of all people?..i guess money squats doesn’t it so much for the right thing to fine but without editor its much less as many of us do not/will not use winblows for obvious reasons…

    gez why is it so hard to develop cross-platform products??..the libraries are out there gez guys


  12. Anonymous Says:

    I don’t know about you guys, but UT2003 runs about twice as slowly under linux than it does in windows.

    Do you think that linux 3D drivers will be good enough to run Doom 3 acceptably when it comes out?

  13. Anonymous Says:

    But here it is: Linux as a desktop platform does not have the kind of user numbers needed to financially justify a port of [i]any[/i] software, least of all games (since very, very few Linux desktop users are gamers). Carmack has said before that he ports to Mac and Linux because it’s “the right thing to do” not for any financial reasons (of which there are none).

    Fly off the handle on this if you like but the important thing to understand here is that you [i]do[/i] get to play the game under Linux (providing the graphics drivers are up to snuff by the time D3 ships), and frankly thats all that should matter at this point. This isn’t a fight that needs to be picked at this point. I’m sure the open source community will come up with a solution after the game ships.

  14. Anonymous Says:

    fine..there goes my desire to back or play anything related to quake/doom


  15. ThoreauHD Says:

    New UT2003 patch 2186 out as of today(1/2/03 or 2/1/03 if your american).

    And Carmack is a guy that has the intuition to know what will work and what won’t. That’s what makes him top game monkey. He can see past the current trend, and implement the new(graphical engines, Lin/Mac ports). That’s why he isn’t releasing Unreal II or DNF or some other notalent assclown game like that.

    In regards to the editor, to tell you the truth, I don’t give a shit. All I know is that I’ve never haven’t seen a Windows person buy a game in 10 years, but linux people seem to to quite fanatical about paying Uncle Enzo when they get a product. The rest will work itself out.

  16. Anonymous Says:

  17. Anonymous Says:

  18. Anonymous Says:

    This is acceptable. I know there are always be other agencies that independently engineer an editor of some kind for products that don’t fill market void.

    I think it would be verry convenient and kind for ID Software to decide upon including the Doom3/Linux/X86 binary program on the same Compact Disc as the Microsoft Windows and Apple Mac OSX binary programs.

    And of’cours, may Carmack speculate on the availability of a Linux/Alpha (and mayyyyybe Linux/PPC) binary program?

    The Alpha Troll

  19. Anonymous Says:

    ID Software doesn’t need to spend unnecessary time time on making an initialy-designed almost non-portable editor run on Linux. I know there is always a group of K-razy developers willing to fill the void by coding their own independent application that compliments ID Software.

    What I do think is convenient is ID Software include the Linux binary program on the same commercialy-sold Compact Disc/boxed retail product as the Microsoft Windows and Apple Mac OSX software. That is convenient for me and many other ID Software supporters, who do not have access to high-speed internet access to download any large peices of software in ethical time.

    And while brother Carmack is interested in maximum market penetration, perhaps they may consider to also build Doom3 for Linux/Alpha and Linux/PPC? Many computer owners out here are using good 3D performance with Opensource drivers and allows us to enjoy the freedoms of using operating system software that doesn’t abridge our rights. We all can appreciate this.

    The Alpha Troll

  20. Karn Says:

    Since every time I hit reply to a post, it tries to make me reply to the
    top-most thread poster, I’ll just start a new thread.

    All I said was thanks to Transgaming, I made my personal switch to 100% gaming
    under Linux, and immediately all the anti-wine zealots jump to conclusions and
    attack me from all directions.

    First of all, I have been buying Loki games ever since the company was in
    business, and the last game I bought from the was Kohan. I bought quite a few
    tites from Loki, and I still play them. Native games. I only play Windows
    games on occasions, and I use Linux all of the time.

    I made my switch to Linux gaming about a year ago because the only game I played
    was Counter-strike, and there was no chance in hell of the game being ported.
    However, I wanted to actually *USE* Linux day-to-day, because it means alot for
    people to use it. Why does it matter if I just use Linux?
    Every time you visit a website, your OS is registered. Every time a game comes
    out, and it’s not released for Linux, you’re MUCH more inclined to send a
    friendly email to the company and let them know that one of their customers has
    switched platforms, and you’d love to continue purchasing games from them..
    People who dual boot don’t do this. When you use Linux, full time, it MAKES A
    DIFFERENCE. Sometimes not a small difference, but it does.

    Of course, I played a Windows game for a while, got my fill, but guess what?
    After I was burnt out on the game, I was USING LINUX. Not only do I use Linux, but I don’t go out and buy a ton of games that don’t run under Linux, I got to Tuxgames. End of story.

    Anyway, my original post still stands. People who game under Windows are
    placing their vote for Windows, and are not helping the Linux gaming situation. People who attack others
    for using Wine to play a game that would never be ported are also not helping
    the gaming situation.

    The only thing that will help Linux gaming is if Linux actually has a bunch of
    full-time gamers who don’t do things like go buy Neverwinter Nights and play it
    under Windows because they can’t wait for the Native version and they had a dual-boot setup going.
    We can’t expect developers to port their game to appease a very small percentage of gamers. That isn’t going to get us games. A healthy Linux gaming audience will get us games.

  21. Anonymous Says:

    port the freespace2 editor instead

  22. Anonymous Says:

    This is just even more incentive to those people
    who currently use GtkRadiant to edit Quake3/RTCW/etc..
    levels, to push for Doom3 support in the editor.

    The fact is, there are some very clever people
    developing and using GtkRadiant. Some of those
    people use Linux exclusively, and most, if not all,
    will be playing Doom3 for a large part of this year.

    Think back to the Quake3/Quake2 releases. The editors
    that were released for those games, were win32
    only (iirc neither were released _with_ the games).
    But thanks to Loki and co, the editor was ported
    to gtk and is now maintained by mostly volunteer
    developers and runs on both Linux and Win32, and
    more recently OSX.

    iirc, id Software has never officially released a level
    editor for the Linux platform.

    I’ll be buying and playing Doom3 on Linux as soon
    as it is available. And editing Doom3 content on
    Linux as soon as that capability is available, and
    if it needs help getting done…

  23. rafaMEX Says:

    look at the past, look at Jedi Knight I community, WE didn’t had ANY FRAGGIN OFFICIAL editor for Jedi knight I, and did we need it at all? hell no, go out and research about if u dont know (and u don’t). do we need one for Doom 3? bah.. I don’t, yeah it’s going to take time, but remmember WE’RE not winblowslusers for christ sake… we are the ALL mighty Linux community. :P

  24. Anonymous Says:

    I agree thats its pretty sad that we dont get the editor, but hey, we get the client to what might be one of the best single player FPS to come out in 2003.

    Beside, I’m pretty sure the gtkradiant people will get doom3 support implemented in a few months.

    Meanwhile, as someone else says, you can still play window’s users levels.

    Don’t blame Carmack for this, he is not the head at Id anyway… And, who knows, the level editor code might be ported to linux/osx later and released as a “patch”.

    If you dont get Doom3 for the sole reason that it doesnt have an editor included, you are shooting yourself in the foot… as well as in every linux gamers’ feet out there.

  25. Anonymous Says:

    So opensource the editor code.

    problem solved/crisis over.

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